Transcript – Dentology Podcast recording with Nathan Welch
Episode release date – Monday 30 October 2023
Andy & Chris:
here now we’re here now we’re here now which is good don’t you love technology So another episode coming our way. It is indeed. Here we are, business of dentistry. It is, it is. And drum roll. This week, this week, we are stretching across the border. We are heading to South Wales. And today we are joined by Nathan Welch. And Nathan is a dentist, has a PG cert in orthodontics, the co-principal at E-Bond Fine Dental Care in Cowbridge. I hope I’ve got the pronunciation correct, but I’ll
Nathan Welch:
That was
Andy & Chris:
probably
Nathan Welch:
pretty
Andy & Chris:
get
Nathan Welch:
good.
Andy & Chris:
chastised by Welsh people all over the place. Cowbridge, I’ve been to Cowbridge. beautiful
Nathan Welch:
is
Andy & Chris:
place
Nathan Welch:
awesome.
Andy & Chris:
and also building another practice as we recalled so he’s a man with a lot going on and he’s married and he’s got kids there’s lots of plates that are spinning welcome nathan how you’re doing
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, really good. Nice to meet you guys this morning.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
Nathan Welch:
And
Andy & Chris:
brilliant.
Nathan Welch:
yeah, there are a lot of plates spinning at the moment.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, yeah, although I think we said before there’s that phrase isn’t there that if you want something done ask a busy person And there’s no doubt that I think as life moves on and more things come your way and there’s more plates spinning We do have that innate ability to somehow cope We just able to take more and more on
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, I think that’s true. The more you have to do, you just have to get it done. There’s no option.
Andy & Chris:
That’s right. Just make sure you don’t collapse at the end of it. Exactly,
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
exactly. You got a little bit of energy left for some fun. Before we get into your dental career, and clearly there’s a lot to chew through today, can we kind of go back to the beginning and just get a sense of, you know, your upbringing, you know, what did your parents instill in you? How did they kind of forge you so you’re the person you are today?
Nathan Welch:
Well, I’m from Cornwall originally. I’m not from Wales, but I did move here for uni. But yeah, I loved living in Cornwall. We lived right by the beach when
Andy & Chris:
Were
Nathan Welch:
I
Andy & Chris:
you
Nathan Welch:
was
Andy & Chris:
a
Nathan Welch:
a
Andy & Chris:
surfer
Nathan Welch:
kid.
Andy & Chris:
dude, Nathan?
Nathan Welch:
I was, I’m a bit old, a bit fat now, you know.
Andy & Chris:
HAHAHAHA I think once a surfer dude, always a surfer dude though, aren’t you?
Nathan Welch:
But yeah, I loved the beach. Before I started doing dentistry, I was a beach lifeguard. did that for several
Andy & Chris:
Ah,
Nathan Welch:
summers. So yeah,
Andy & Chris:
excellent.
Nathan Welch:
I lived on the beach really. I was always good at school, got good grades, more by luck than hard work at school I think. Dad worked as a teacher so I think he instilled sort of good learning in me at home and I didn’t really know what I wanted to do. I’d probably have been quite happy being a beach lifeguard forever but you know. although it’s
Andy & Chris:
You could
Nathan Welch:
a fun
Andy & Chris:
have gone
Nathan Welch:
job,
Andy & Chris:
to Bondi
Nathan Welch:
it’s not a way
Andy & Chris:
or something
Nathan Welch:
to probably
Andy & Chris:
and then…
Nathan Welch:
make a profession.
Andy & Chris:
No,
Nathan Welch:
And
Andy & Chris:
I guess David
Nathan Welch:
I
Andy & Chris:
Hasselhoff
Nathan Welch:
had
Andy & Chris:
had that job, didn’t he?
Nathan Welch:
really good advice at school from our sixth form tutor. And he said, look, you know, you’ve got the grades, you could go and do basically anything you want. We’d recommend doing medicine or dentistry. And I didn’t really want to do medicine. never wanted to work in a hospital. I never wanted to work any night shifts at all. I’d have been absolutely useless working at night. Hats off to those that
Andy & Chris:
Right.
Nathan Welch:
do, that can work one night, sleep in the day and then sleep the night the next day and get up in the day. I just couldn’t do that to myself.
Andy & Chris:
All right.
Nathan Welch:
So I said, all right, yeah, I’ll apply to do dentistry. Sort of on a whim. I did do a little bit of work experience at the local dentist by me. Thought, oh yeah, that seems all right, a job. Applied to four universities and got offers. chose Cardiff because when I went to interview, really liked Cardiff as a city, really liked the dental school and the staff there seemed really friendly. So I put them as my top choice. Got in, moved to Cardiff in 2005. Studied in dental school there, came out, went into a position, an NHS position after VT up in the valleys in Merthyr. Stayed there for nearly 10 years then actually.
Andy & Chris:
Oh
Nathan Welch:
quite happily
Andy & Chris:
wow, oh okay.
Nathan Welch:
working as an associate. I had another job, another associate job on the side, that was my main job. And then that got taken over by a corporate and there was a little bit of a falling out and that sort of gave me a push to change that job. And then I sort of flitted about a bit, I changed my other job as well. And then eventually came to own the practice that I worked at in one of them and then things have spiraled from there really.
Andy & Chris:
and no dentists or medics in the family.
Nathan Welch:
None at all, no.
Andy & Chris:
Ah, okay. It’s interesting, going back to your careers advice at school, did the sixth form tutor, did they kind of quickly jump to medicine and dentistry? Were there other options and avenues? Did you explore other kind of non-health care professions or did it kind of become dental quite quickly?
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, I actually did a weeks long residential for engineering at Cambridge University. I think that was in lower sixth form and I actually didn’t like it at all. And
Andy & Chris:
Right.
Nathan Welch:
although I had the grades to go and do engineering, I decided that wasn’t for me actually.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, yeah, it’s it and given the way things have panned out do you think that was good careers advice Would you choose dentistry again if you could go back to being 17 year old Nathan?
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, I think I would. I moan about it a lot, but who doesn’t
Andy & Chris:
Hahahaha!
Nathan Welch:
moan about their job, right? There’s no ideal job. You know, there’s a surfer, Kelly Slater, and he said, the worst thing you can do, I’m paraphrasing, but the worst thing you can do is do something you love as your job because you will
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
fall out of love with it.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah. Yeah, I think yeah, you’re right. And I think the other side is that until you’re immersed in it and you’re completely immersed in dentistry, you don’t see it from every dimension. And when you look at other people’s lives or other people’s careers or jobs or whatever, we kind of only see the bit that they show us. So quite often other things can look more interesting. And I think you adapt, don’t you? Also, because there’s bits in every job that you don’t necessarily really like. And there’s other bits that you can say, Oh, I really like this bit. in totality, you look at the whole job, you know, part of it might be you just love talking to people. Well, that’s a really important part of dentistry. It might be you love the clinical, you know, fiddly bit. Well, that’s really part of dentistry. I think the fact you can almost make it what you want. I think you’re right, Nathan. Danger is you sort of almost diss the whole thing and sort of forget the good bits and not focus on the not so good bits. You kind of skiffled through your dental scored experience quite quickly. A smart kid at school. Did you find lucky lucky? You said I love
Nathan Welch:
Thank
Andy & Chris:
the phrase of lucky
Nathan Welch:
you.
Andy & Chris:
because you don’t get lucky I tell you I think yeah, you have to work reasonably hard to be lucky. I love I’ve got nine I was just lucky. I was just lucky. I just turned up But what was dental school like for you? Did you find that um, Equally, you know from a kind of clinical technical point of view was it quite easy for you to grasp or were there challenges? On that side, what was the whole experience like at dental school?
Nathan Welch:
I found it difficult. It was definitely sort of a learning curve of
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
how difficult it was to learn the sort of academic material.
Andy & Chris:
Right.
Nathan Welch:
The hands-on bit, that always came fairly naturally, but the sort of high-level reading and stuff, I really struggled with that. That was a step up from sixth form that
Andy & Chris:
my
Nathan Welch:
I wasn’t really prepared for. I had to be quite disciplined with myself and I’m
Andy & Chris:
Have
Nathan Welch:
very,
Andy & Chris:
you always…
Nathan Welch:
very easily distracted.
Andy & Chris:
Right. Oh, okay. Are you really, have you always been really good with your hands? You know, in sort of like doing stuff, did you like do models or making
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, I
Andy & Chris:
sort
Nathan Welch:
guess
Andy & Chris:
of
Nathan Welch:
I
Andy & Chris:
like,
Nathan Welch:
did, yeah.
Andy & Chris:
you know, taking an engine to pieces or something and just putting it back together? Because you thought, hey, why
Nathan Welch:
Yeah,
Andy & Chris:
not?
Nathan Welch:
I mean, I’ve never taken an engine apart, but yeah, I used to like doing models and things like that.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, I think that’s the thing that I always found fascinating about dentistry is that it’s incredibly complicated But also you not only have to have the brain power to be able to do it because you have to identify What’s going on? But you also have to have the mechanical skills to be able to do it and I think that’s a Fascinating blend of people which is why sometimes we can see as you will know some dentists who are really good at the mechanical Bit but not so good at the communication bit
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
It’s fascinating. Like you said, there’s lots of elements, you know, over the years, obviously, we see and talk to lots of dentists through our other job, kind of, evaluating and setting dental practices. And I always find it fascinating how you can see people who are amazing people, they’re really likeable and have a phenomenal business. And we’re not clinical at all, but we hear from other dentists that they’re not the best clinically, yet they have a really successful business. Then you have other people who might be professors and clinically they are renowned but they could never make business work and
Nathan Welch:
Mm.
Andy & Chris:
having a sweet spot where you can kind of put a tick in every box but it’s not necessarily a massive tick it’s just a tick so you’re good enough in each category I think from a from a business ownership point of view that those people tend to do which sort of say who would you want to have a drink with don’t you? yeah exactly
Nathan Welch:
It’s definitely that. You can’t be good at one aspect of it if you want to run a practice, I don’t think. It’s all you need someone else who’s not sat next to
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
me, but you know, Lara, who you’ve met, Andy, my wife, she’s
Andy & Chris:
Yes.
Nathan Welch:
a dentist as well and she is fantastic. She’s a fantastic dentist and clinician as well, but she’s much better admin and things like that than I am.
Andy & Chris:
Mm. Yeah, I think you need to have those mutual skills don’t you run in a business otherwise if you’re all both the same It’s a bit of a disaster and I must admit I’m always in awe of sole principles or people who run a business on their own I think the responsibility and you need to be good at so many things. It’s it’s so incredibly hard I think a partnership whether it’s business partners Husband and wife whatever that setup is it just means that you can lean into the bits that you’re strong at and like you say If love is great with people then you know not to say you’re not
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
If she’s stronger than you then why wouldn’t she take that over? You need to download don’t you? I remember when we bought the business, whatever 23 years ago. So I originally was in the business to start with and Andy bless him. Yeah, I would say virtually every day We had a debrief. Every day on our way home driving. I would tell Andy about the day
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
Normally how annoying it was and it was we used to say if you were on your own download that too, whereas I was so lucky to have Andy to be able to download it too.
Nathan Welch:
I’ve got a friend who bought practice very close in time to us, I think three months maybe before we took over Carbridge. His wife is non-dental and she doesn’t work in the company. I know for a fact he misses what me and Lara have,
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
being able to talk about the business together and make joint decisions. Because like you’ve just said, if you are a sole principal, it’s lonely at the top.
Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm. Yeah, very. Mm-hmm. So it’s take us back to the fact of you sort of were Associated for a while and then it’s sort of like you yet again glossed over there Well, and we just bought the practice I was in so how did that how did that sort of occur?
Nathan Welch:
So two things happened concurrently. So I had two associate jobs and one of them got taken over by a corporate and I was looking for a new job, sort of looking, but my friends knew I was looking, they own a dental practice as well. And they said, look, we’re looking for a member of staff. Can you come and work for us? They said, you know, I could do. It was a bit of a pay cut from where I was. The UDA value wasn’t as good. And I thought I’m gonna have to make up that somehow. And I knew they used to do dental foundation training. and it’s something that I had wanted to do, but just hadn’t had time to do before. So I thought, right, well, that will fill in the void of my wages and it would be something that I’d wanted to do for a while. So I said, look, I’ll come and work for you with the proviso we can apply for Dental Foundation training. They were like, yep, that’s great. There’s space if you get it, then we can do up an old surgery and the foundation dentist can go there. So that was great. I said, right, I handed my notice here and then I did all the training for… that the additional training I needed to do to be an educational supervisor for Dental Foundation training. Got that lucky, again, you know, people say, just a lucky guy, tell
Andy & Chris:
I’ll
Nathan Welch:
me
Andy & Chris:
be
Nathan Welch:
one.
Andy & Chris:
just
Nathan Welch:
Got that
Andy & Chris:
a sit.
Nathan Welch:
on my first application. And yeah,
Andy & Chris:
We
Nathan Welch:
I’ve
Andy & Chris:
might
Nathan Welch:
been
Andy & Chris:
have
Nathan Welch:
doing
Andy & Chris:
to call this
Nathan Welch:
dental.
Andy & Chris:
episode,
Nathan Welch:
So
Andy & Chris:
he’s not lucky. Oh yeah.
Nathan Welch:
I got that. And actually I’ve absolutely loved doing that. So
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
in that associate role, I’ve been educational supervisor as well. And I’ve had three foundation dentists come through. where I’ve mentored them out. And actually that’s probably one of the most rewarding things I’ve done in my career, although I’m
Andy & Chris:
Brilliant.
Nathan Welch:
not doing it next year because I just haven’t got the time. That’s
Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm.
Nathan Welch:
been amazing. So if anyone has been thinking about that, I would recommend sort of getting involved in that foundation training. The youngsters coming out, they really keep you on your toes. You know, they’ll keep you in mind. When you’re having a rough day, they’ll come in and they just, they’ll pick your brain. And when they leave, you think, yeah, my life’s all right.
Andy & Chris:
Hahaha!
Nathan Welch:
They’re worrying about the smallest things and you’re like, what if this is all they’ve got to worry about what am I worrying about? You know, come on
Andy & Chris:
It’s quite a good one, it’s a bit of a grounder really isn’t it? Exactly. Having the benefit of the younger dentists come kind of through and train them, what’s your take on what your dental experience is like in terms of when you got spewed out into the dental world to treat patients compared to the young people who are graduating today? Are they better equipped, not as equipped as well?
Nathan Welch:
they are definitely not as equipped and they would be open to tell you that themselves. That
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
I’ve only had them since post-COVID, okay? So the first
Andy & Chris:
show.
Nathan Welch:
one I had was during COVID, it was 2020. And he had a pretty rough undergraduate curriculum like
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
he hardly saw any patients, but that seems to have become almost the norm at the dental hospital. They’re coming out, they’ve done very little clinical work. They’ve done a lot of, you know. what’s it called, like written work and learned work.
Andy & Chris:
Lots of
Nathan Welch:
They
Andy & Chris:
theory
Nathan Welch:
do hundreds
Andy & Chris:
and stuff.
Nathan Welch:
of hours on litigation, but what they don’t do is
Andy & Chris:
Wow.
Nathan Welch:
hundreds of hours of hands-on work on patients. And they’re coming out, they might have only done half a root canal, or the one I’ve had this year, it did two halves of a root canal. So that’s not enough clinical experience to be released into the world, in my opinion. But you just
Andy & Chris:
No, but he’s
Nathan Welch:
take
Andy & Chris:
crazy
Nathan Welch:
them,
Andy & Chris:
isn’t it? But he’s
Nathan Welch:
yeah,
Andy & Chris:
crazy
Nathan Welch:
they’re
Andy & Chris:
you
Nathan Welch:
like
Andy & Chris:
saying
Nathan Welch:
a piece
Andy & Chris:
that
Nathan Welch:
of plasticine and you just gotta
Andy & Chris:
yeah
Nathan Welch:
take them and mold them in.
Andy & Chris:
but they’re spending hundreds of hours on litigation. We spoke to Jason Wong last week, the CDO, and he was saying, and we were talking about kind of, you know, the risks of litigation and the challenges of dentists, and like he was saying, you are not gonna get struck off for taking out the wrong tooth. You know, people that get struck off for taking out the wrong tooth, it wasn’t that. It was that they hid the error, or they misdirected people or deceived.
Nathan Welch:
Exactly
Andy & Chris:
It wasn’t
Nathan Welch:
that.
Andy & Chris:
necessarily that. So it’s heartbreaking to hear that so much time has been spent on litigation dentists when in the real world as long as you’re doing the right thing but you’re doing things the right way I think the
Nathan Welch:
Mm-hmm.
Andy & Chris:
profession will support you
Nathan Welch:
Yeah,
Andy & Chris:
so it
Nathan Welch:
I
Andy & Chris:
just seems
Nathan Welch:
agree.
Andy & Chris:
that we’re spending a lot or the young dentists are a lot of time working on something which you’re almost kind of building fear from day one. It’s a real interesting one isn’t it because as Jason said and you just said and we see and you know we hear at those meetings we go to it’s that young dentists are scared of is this being sued and
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, it genuinely is, yeah.
Andy & Chris:
losing their livelihood and that’s got a change hasn’t it really because otherwise you’re either not going to get people into the profession or you’re going to get people who will only do you know I’m gonna be a one-trick pony I’m gonna do this I mean we were talking to some dude was that guy I can’t remember some guy and he said yeah he’s his foundation dentist had never done an extraction and they were quite happy doing I think an incisor or one of these whatever these are but they’d never ever attempted a molar and he was saying you know it’s mad you’ve got these people coming out who haven’t had the clinical time but they can write really good notes yeah
Nathan Welch:
Oh yeah, their notes. So
Andy & Chris:
Hahaha
Nathan Welch:
one of her foundation dentists, I had to give her an hour at the end of each day just to finish off her notes. And she was still running late. Some of the days she
Andy & Chris:
Wow.
Nathan Welch:
was still there half past six, seven o’clock. And I just said to
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
her, you’ve got to go home. She’s like, I’ve got to get my notes done. I’m like, I know you’ve got to get your notes done, but there’s a happy medium somewhere.
Andy & Chris:
Do you think these and this is just a one thing about you do you think these are oral? You know dictation things will they help you know where people can actually just say what they’ve
Nathan Welch:
I’ve never
Andy & Chris:
done
Nathan Welch:
used one, but I think yes, if they come in and
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
Nathan Welch:
they are good, then that
Andy & Chris:
yeah
Nathan Welch:
could definitely help people.
Andy & Chris:
Because we used to
Nathan Welch:
Well, help
Andy & Chris:
have an
Nathan Welch:
me!
Andy & Chris:
interest
Nathan Welch:
You
Andy & Chris:
yeah
Nathan Welch:
know, help everyone.
Andy & Chris:
We used to have an interest in a law firm Didn’t we and when uh when they first came out, do you remember was it called dragon or something? It was absolutely shocking. Especially if he had an accent that wasn’t like a
Nathan Welch:
it.
Andy & Chris:
You know a perceived english or whatever they call it And then it fight it’s been getting much better because I think if you could do that verbally Then that’s got to be better than writing notes or whatever because at least you could almost do it as you were doing the consultation couldn’t you? Probably in real time. Yeah. So you bought your practice back in 2021, is that right?
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, 2021
Andy & Chris:
Was it the
Nathan Welch:
we completed, yeah.
Andy & Chris:
back end of 21?
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
So can you just describe just what that practice looks like? I think it’s an interesting make up.
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, so that’s actually the other, that’s not the one where I’m foundation trainer, that was my other job. So that was, it’s five minutes from my house and I’d been working there for about three years, but I’d actually been working for the owners for about seven years because they, it’s a really, it’s a convoluted story, but I’ll try and explain it. So the practice was owned by my ex-boss, he sold it to a corporate going back, I don’t know, 15 years ago or something like that. They got sold to another corporate. They ran it into the ground. My ex-boss then bought his own practice back at a fraction of the
Andy & Chris:
Ha
Nathan Welch:
cost
Andy & Chris:
ha
Nathan Welch:
that he sold
Andy & Chris:
ha.
Nathan Welch:
it for. And when they took over, most of the staff left to stay with the corporate, I think. And they bought me in from the other practice that I was working at, which was very kind of them because
Andy & Chris:
No.
Nathan Welch:
it was much closer to my house. So it was saving me sort of 45 minutes each way.
Andy & Chris:
Well,
Nathan Welch:
So that was
Andy & Chris:
lovely.
Nathan Welch:
a massive time saving for me.
Andy & Chris:
Hmm, you
Nathan Welch:
and
Andy & Chris:
might
Nathan Welch:
I worked
Andy & Chris:
even say
Nathan Welch:
there
Andy & Chris:
lucky.
Nathan Welch:
happily under them. What’d you say, Andy?
Andy & Chris:
You might even say lucky.
Nathan Welch:
Lucky, yeah, you know.
Andy & Chris:
This
Nathan Welch:
I worked
Andy & Chris:
bloke
Nathan Welch:
there
Andy & Chris:
is
Nathan Welch:
happily
Andy & Chris:
saying,
Nathan Welch:
under
Andy & Chris:
what
Nathan Welch:
them.
Andy & Chris:
do you reckon are the lottery numbers first? That’s a good one.
Nathan Welch:
So I worked under them there for I think three years and then COVID hit and it was never, they were already struggling profitability wise and they had three practices then during COVID and I think it was just too much to shoulder that loss and they sort of said, look, we need out of this one, do you want to buy it or if not, we’re going to have to sell it anyway. So I said, well, don’t sell it to anyone. Let me have a little think, because I’d been in a position where I’d been sold out to a corporate before and it left me quite unhappy. And I spoke to Lara and she was like, well, it wasn’t really on our radar to buy a practice, but yeah, we could probably do it. So we spoke to the bank and you get some advice. We decided to go for it. They wanted a quick sale and we tried to push for a quick sale, but I think in dentistry, there’s no such thing as a quick sale.
Andy & Chris:
No,
Nathan Welch:
That
Andy & Chris:
as soon as you involve
Nathan Welch:
is
Andy & Chris:
lawyers.
Nathan Welch:
what I’m learning. You know, it took almost, you know, best part of a year to go through. And it was a lot of stress. It strained that relationship between me
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
and the other two principals that were there before. You know, it’s all okay, but it was definitely, it put a strain on that relationship while we were trying to take over.
Andy & Chris:
Did you have anyone acting as an intermediary or was it just you and the seller, the indirect communication?
Nathan Welch:
direct communication, yeah.
Andy & Chris:
It’s a tricky one. We quite often say to people when, you know, people obviously, Frank Taylor served dental practice and we sort of say to them, sometimes it’s really good to have someone in the middle because we act as, because we sort of say, it acts as a translator. You know, you want to say something because you’re really pissed off about something. So we then translate that into less aggressive terms.
Nathan Welch:
Yeah,
Andy & Chris:
And
Nathan Welch:
I can see
Andy & Chris:
I think
Nathan Welch:
how that would be really
Andy & Chris:
it doesn’t
Nathan Welch:
helpful.
Andy & Chris:
have to be a broker, but I think the answer is it’s quite good to have an independent, you can almost vent at that person and then that can be communicated. Yeah I think it is, it’s a translator we call it.
Nathan Welch:
It’s just a stressful time, isn’t it? You know, if you
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
Nathan Welch:
think
Andy & Chris:
it
Nathan Welch:
about
Andy & Chris:
is. Of
Nathan Welch:
buying
Andy & Chris:
course
Nathan Welch:
a
Andy & Chris:
it
Nathan Welch:
house,
Andy & Chris:
is. Mmm.
Nathan Welch:
that’s stressful. Doing any sort of big transaction like that is
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
gonna be stressful.
Andy & Chris:
So what’s the profile of the practice look like? What are the income streams you’ve got there?
Nathan Welch:
So when we took over, it was running about a 75% NHS to 25% private split. And there were four surgeries of which we were only running at capacity for two surgeries a day.
Andy & Chris:
Wow.
Nathan Welch:
So that was part of the reason they’re taking over. We could see that there was probably scope to grow.
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
When we took over, neither of the principals were working there, whereas I was gonna be working there. So
Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm makes
Nathan Welch:
more
Andy & Chris:
a difference
Nathan Welch:
sort of feet on the ground, so to speak. So it looked like a viable business, even with COVID in the background. And yeah,
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
we’ve just spent the last two years increasing sort of how many of the surgeries are full. And we’re not fully up to capacity. I’d say we’re gonna be sort of up to three, three and a half,
Andy & Chris:
Wow.
Nathan Welch:
if you average it through the week, surgeries a day now. And when we
Andy & Chris:
Berlin.
Nathan Welch:
get to four, hopefully, you know, then I’ll be happy then. Well,
Andy & Chris:
Ah,
Nathan Welch:
I’m
Andy & Chris:
I think
Nathan Welch:
happy
Andy & Chris:
you have
Nathan Welch:
anyway, but
Andy & Chris:
to be honest. I
Nathan Welch:
you
Andy & Chris:
think
Nathan Welch:
know.
Andy & Chris:
coming out of the back of COVID, I think you’ve done an incredible job. So you’ve been really lucky. Yeah. So you’ve owned a business now for a couple of years. What, what’s that process taught you? What, what you learned in those two years?
Nathan Welch:
Don’t do it, but then I’m doing it again. So it hasn’t taught me any lesson whatsoever. Yeah,
Andy & Chris:
I was gonna say don’t do it says the guy who’s just building a new practice down the road.
Nathan Welch:
no. What’s it taught me? That
Andy & Chris:
Stay a bodyguard.
Nathan Welch:
it’s
Andy & Chris:
I said
Nathan Welch:
very,
Andy & Chris:
a bodyguard.
Nathan Welch:
very
Andy & Chris:
Stay
Nathan Welch:
stressful
Andy & Chris:
a-
Nathan Welch:
and it is a time sponge. I really miss, you know, I was always a tight person. I run a really tight ship at work. I was done early every day. All my patients used to come early and they’d know I’d see them and I’d be out the door. As soon as that full stop was done on my last notes, I pick up my bag and I’d be gone. Always pre five o’clock. It was a joke. If people saw me past five o’clock, they’re like, you’re gonna turn into a pumpkin now because it was like a Cinderella thing. But now, you might see me there three hours after I finished work still just pottering around doing bits. And it just sucks up all of your time. And you come home
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
and obviously, if you’ve not got kids, you’ve not got kids, but we have got kids. You do all the kids stuff.
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
You have your dinner and then you’ve got to turn your brain back on most nights and do more admin. You know, I’m sure that will eventually stop, but certainly in the first few years, first two years we’ve had it and it has got better. That first six months was the worst. And then the first year,
Andy & Chris:
Hmm
Nathan Welch:
you know, another 12 months after that was still a lot. But now it is settling down. But obviously I’ve started again. So.
Andy & Chris:
Hmm. And is that obviously Lars, your wife, business partner, you know, um, working with you on the new project, how do you split that out to make sure that, you know, you kind of have that, that time together as a family, you’re not always talking about business, you know, you’re not both working in the evening. Not one of you is always working the evening, so you don’t get time together. Is that quite challenging?
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, I don’t have the answer for that. Cause I think our split
Andy & Chris:
Mmm.
Nathan Welch:
probably isn’t right at the moment, but it is what it is. You know,
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
hopefully there’s light at the end of the tunnel. Like I say, Cowbridge
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
has got a lot better. It almost runs itself now. We’ve got a good practice manager on board. And yeah, I know we’re starting again, but that’s our own fault really, isn’t it? We knew what we were getting in for.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, I think it is tricky isn’t it? We’ve sort of said sometimes to couples, you know, what you should try and do is Almost book appointment times when you sort of talk about business, but it is tricky because Unless you’re super disciplined. It’s sort of like leeches out, you know, Sunday morning when you’re having a walk down the park or something you go It’s like no Try and be you know husband and wife or whatever it is and then do business partners when you can but it is tricky There’s no doubt. Yeah It’s all consuming. It
Nathan Welch:
Yeah,
Andy & Chris:
is all consuming
Nathan Welch:
we do have a scheduled meeting once a month. We use a business consultancy firm, the James Brosson Consultancy, and
Andy & Chris:
Ah,
Nathan Welch:
we do
Andy & Chris:
yeah,
Nathan Welch:
have a timetabled
Andy & Chris:
yeah.
Nathan Welch:
sort of two hours a month where we go through the cash flow and sort of how the business is doing. That’s been really good.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
Like when we took over, we had no idea how to run a business,
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
and they’ve really helped.
Andy & Chris:
I think if you don’t know, I think the great thing of having that is a brilliant one for people to listen about the fact of you need to have a meeting to understand you need to understand your numbers Don’t you? Oh, yeah And how it all works because otherwise it all sort of like blends into one really and I think that’s a brilliant move to have said actually I need someone to Sit down because it’s so important because otherwise the danger is you sort of flog your guts out and then you don’t Know what you’re financially doing, but at least if you’ve got the number I think what’s that grip? it on when you talk about grip is having the grip on your numbers. I think it’s really important, really good idea, really good idea.
Nathan Welch:
We definitely
Andy & Chris:
Did you think about that
Nathan Welch:
have got
Andy & Chris:
Nathan
Nathan Welch:
more appreciation
Andy & Chris:
or?
Nathan Welch:
now of the numbers that need to, like the money that needs to come in to make the business viable. And, you know, me, myself and Lara, we didn’t take any money out of the business in the first 12 months at all. We just relied on, like, I still had my other job and Lara still had her other job and that’s
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
sort of what kept us personally afloat and we’re still not really taking any money out of it now, but we do take some out now. But, you know, I think if people think that they’re going to take over a dental practice and they’re going to be earning, I don’t know what people
Andy & Chris:
Hehehe
Nathan Welch:
want to earn, you know, a hundred thousand a year, you know, fair play to them if they can make that happen in the first few years, but certainly I’ve found it incredibly difficult to make it make money.
Andy & Chris:
Right, yeah. What
Nathan Welch:
And
Andy & Chris:
made
Nathan Welch:
I think
Andy & Chris:
you
Nathan Welch:
without
Andy & Chris:
engage, Jane?
Nathan Welch:
Jane and
Andy & Chris:
Was
Nathan Welch:
John’s
Andy & Chris:
it
Nathan Welch:
person’s
Andy & Chris:
you?
Nathan Welch:
help, we wouldn’t have been viable at all right now. You know,
Andy & Chris:
And did
Nathan Welch:
they
Andy & Chris:
you…
Nathan Welch:
took one look at our prices and said, look, you are great. going to go bankrupt if you don’t do something.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, did you decide to engage her or did she sort of like was it some marketing you saw? How did it sort of you end up
Nathan Welch:
No,
Andy & Chris:
making
Nathan Welch:
so
Andy & Chris:
that
Nathan Welch:
I engaged
Andy & Chris:
decision?
Nathan Welch:
her actually. I’d listen to her speak a lot online. During COVID, people had a lot of time to listen to other people
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
speak with me and listen to lots of webinars and things like that. And
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
yourself, Andy, I listened to you a lot as well. And yeah, I reached out to her then, actually.
Andy & Chris:
Mmm, it’s good. That’s good. That’s another lesson for people listening. Yeah, it’s good that you’ve got a good understanding of what’s going on. And, you know, you kind of described what sounds like an all-consuming, quite hard start to ownership. And then when we met at the Miles from Isle conference a little while ago, we had dinner together in the evening. You were telling me about your next project, which is you’re setting
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
up a squat dental practice not a million miles from your original one, which is for me is fascinating because it’s an NHS based practice as well. So talk us through how that came about and where’s that project up to? now. Yeah, that is interesting
Nathan Welch:
So
Andy & Chris:
NHS one.
Nathan Welch:
as you mentioned, most people are falling out of love of NHS dentistry, myself
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
included. Okay. I don’t like in this separate, we’re in Wales, so I don’t like the way that the Welsh contract has gone. It’s really separating out, you know, what I think patients need from what the government is willing to pay for. But that’s a discussion for a different time. But
Andy & Chris:
Mmm.
Nathan Welch:
people are handing contracts back and NHS Dunterstreet, it doesn’t make loads of money, but I’m not the type of person that wants loads of money I just want a happy life and the opportunity came up A contract had been handed back in Bridgend and it was out to tender with the health board and it came with sort of a small set up grant that we thought might cover some of the costs are spiralling as they do but that’s
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
by the by. We did and I was tempted to go for it and I was like, oh, shall I shantay? And Lara sort of talked me out of it. I was like, okay, we won’t go for it. But I’d sent it to a friend of mine. He was like, oh, come on, let’s do it. And I was like, oh, Paul wants to do it with us, Lara. She was like, oh, really? Just settling down in Calbridge, you know? And I was like, it’s a really good opportunity to own a second practice. And, you know, then once you’ve got a second practice. be able to work there part-time, it’s sort of not all our eggs in one basket and she’s like, all right, well, let’s apply, we might not get it. So we filled it, it’s quite a lot of work to apply for an NHS tender.
Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
In Wales, it’s the same sort of portal you’d use if you’re applying to make a motorway, I think. And
Andy & Chris:
Hahahaha
Nathan Welch:
some of the questions are quite obscure when you put them in the context of dentistry and you’re sort of ticking something yes and you’re like… I don’t even know really what this is
Andy & Chris:
What have
Nathan Welch:
because
Andy & Chris:
I just checked?
Nathan Welch:
it’s regarding something that’s totally unrelated to a dental practice. But anyway, we did that and we got through to interview and we interviewed and the interview did go really well, don’t get me wrong.
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
It was tough. They sort of grilled us a bit and I was like, oh, I think we probably got that. You know, it was really good. Lara and Paul,
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
Nathan Welch:
far more pessimistic than me. They’re like, no, because we
Andy & Chris:
and
Nathan Welch:
didn’t
Andy & Chris:
don’t
Nathan Welch:
hear
Andy & Chris:
tell
Nathan Welch:
for
Andy & Chris:
me
Nathan Welch:
ages.
Andy & Chris:
that now you’re
Nathan Welch:
It was
Andy & Chris:
contracted
Nathan Welch:
something like the timeline was you should hear by the, I don’t know, the 23rd of November. And over two weeks had gone past and they were like, oh, we’ve not got, we must not have got it. I was like, well, I think we interviewed really well. I still think we’ve got it. They’re like, it’s two, three weeks past when we should have heard. I was like, I know, but the health board runs on their own timeframe.
Andy & Chris:
This is
Nathan Welch:
They,
Andy & Chris:
the NHS,
Nathan Welch:
you
Andy & Chris:
yeah.
Nathan Welch:
know, they missed their times all the time. And then we got the confirmation. They’re like, oh yeah, you interviewed really well and the contracts are yours if you want it. I was like, right. There we are. We’ve got it. Luckily, I do it again, that was lucky. But also I had a patient who is an optician and he was retiring and he had a build, he owned a building in the centre of Bridgend, which is exactly where the contract needed to be. And I knew the building was up for sale because I’ve spoken to him about it. We had a good patient dentist relationship. I knew quite a lot about his business and I knew he was shutting it down completely, sold all his stock. And then I saw his building up for the was going up for sale and I said, oh, look, Rob, I’m really interested in buying your building. And he was like, yeah, it’s yours if you want it. I’d actually engaged with him a little bit before we knew the contract was mine. I said, look, Rob, that building would be perfect. But I don’t know. And because he was in optometry, he was like, look, I know how the
Andy & Chris:
Oh,
Nathan Welch:
health
Andy & Chris:
okay.
Nathan Welch:
board can be.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
I’ll stop having viewings until you hear from the health board, which was obviously really kind
Andy & Chris:
That’s
Nathan Welch:
of him.
Andy & Chris:
brilliant.
Nathan Welch:
Yeah. So he held that building while we were waiting out for the decision. And then that actually did go really quickly. You know, a three month building move is pretty quick, I think.
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
And then that, so we got the contract, got some of the money for the grant. The rest we’re still waiting on. That will come once we’re open. That obviously
Andy & Chris:
No.
Nathan Welch:
helped a bit. And then we had personal investment from myself and Lara and then the other, the other partner, Paul and his wife, Nat. And yeah, the building work is getting on, but costs have spiralled out of control. And
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
I think if anyone was thinking of setting up a squat, you need double the amount of money that you initially think.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, you just like as you’re talking about luck again There is a formula for luck and it’s opportunity plus being prepared
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
equals lucky and as you describe the things You know you have looked for opportunities, but also you’ve been prepared So like with the optician, you know you knew what you were looking to do so yes, you’re going to end up with somebody right in the center of town, but You you pieced together before yeah, you pieced together various elements that you knew were going to work in your favor What’s intriguing is you said you said you know lots of pedentures falling out of love the NHS I’ve you know partly fallen out of love with the NHS myself yet you’re still very loyal to the NHS and you have an NHS contract in Cowbridge and you’ve run a new tender to deliver a contract in Bridgend which arguably is probably a higher need NHS area than
Nathan Welch:
Mm-hmm.
Andy & Chris:
Cowbridge just because of the demographics why are you staying loyal to the NHS?
Nathan Welch:
I enjoy doing dentistry and I enjoy looking after people. Like I said a minute ago, for me, it’s not about the money. Obviously I need money to live. That’s how the world goes around and the business needs to function and
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
pay the staff. But I do genuinely enjoy delivering dentistry. There are parts of dentistry I do not enjoy doing paperwork, writing notes, they’re boring to me, they have no appeal. But meeting people, speaking to people, helping people. Helping people who want to be helped mainly, that does make my, you know, that’s what I like about the job. An NHS dentistry, you get that. I like seeing kids, I know people think I’m crazy, but I like seeing child patients and you’re very unlikely
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
to see those. I know some private practices do see kids, but you’re less likely to see that proportion of kids
Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm
Nathan Welch:
if you don’t have an NHS contract.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, and I think in that context the impact you can have on younger people generally If you can Instill good oral hygiene techniques and the importance of it in kids then hopefully they’ll then live a life with great teeth And great
Nathan Welch:
Yeah,
Andy & Chris:
or
Nathan Welch:
delivering
Andy & Chris:
care
Nathan Welch:
family dentistry is really rewarding. Like if you can see, you know, when you’ve been working at somewhere for a prolonged period of time, you might be seeing three or four generations of the same family.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
Well, you know, you’re looking after them their whole life then really.
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
And it just, it makes, easy is the wrong word. It doesn’t make your life easy. It just makes it enjoyable. You know, you can talk about things that, about the other family members. and things like that, and the patients are very at ease.
Andy & Chris:
I sense you feel a real part of your community, but some of my wife’s family live in cowbridge They still live in cowbridge. So yeah, I think John’s which is on the high street I think many years ago her uncle used to own a few shops on the high street And it’s always struck me as a place that is a very strong community
Nathan Welch:
Yes,
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
Nathan Welch:
yeah.
Andy & Chris:
people know one another and I guess you as being part of that community is quite important and seeing the kids and the parents And grandparents means that you’re an important part of that town
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, it definitely is. And like, you know, people, a lot of people used to tell me, oh, I wouldn’t work too close to where you live. You know, you see them down the shops and stuff, but that doesn’t bother me in any way. You know, if someone, if a patient
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
sees me out and about, just I’ll come and say hello. It’s fine.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
Like,
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
Nathan Welch:
I’ll take my kids
Andy & Chris:
it’s
Nathan Welch:
to the
Andy & Chris:
sort of
Nathan Welch:
park
Andy & Chris:
old
Nathan Welch:
behind
Andy & Chris:
school
Nathan Welch:
the
Andy & Chris:
dentistry,
Nathan Welch:
shop.
Andy & Chris:
isn’t it? Really? Yeah
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
It’s old school dentistry being part of the community like the lawyer used to be part of the community And the bank manager used to be part of the community. Yeah, it’s fascinating Yeah, so for all the detours and troubles and blood sweat and tears that have gone into it Um, if we could wind the clock back, would you have saved an associate or would you do it again?
Nathan Welch:
I would have stayed an associate, I think, at least for five years. I certainly wouldn’t be complicating my life with business ownership until you know what you’re doing dentistry-wise. And it takes time.
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
You don’t come out, well, you certainly don’t come out of dental school and you don’t come out of foundation training ready. You’re much better when you come out of foundation training, but it takes you another couple of years to sort of, to have seen most things that will walk through the door.
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
Otherwise, on a daily basis, you’re seeing something for the first time and that’s stressing you out. You don’t
Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm.
Nathan Welch:
need the added complication of looking after staff and a contract and a building and all the things that go with that.
Andy & Chris:
When did you squeeze in your PG-Cert in orthodontics?
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, I sort of fell into that last year. So I wanted to do that in 2021 because they were running it in Cardiff then and I’d looked
Andy & Chris:
Bye.
Nathan Welch:
at it, but the first weekend date was the due date of our second child, L.D. And Lara
Andy & Chris:
Perfect.
Nathan Welch:
was like, absolutely not, you’re not doing this course. I was like, right, okay, put that on the back burner. And then we went, a year later, we went to the BDA. show and the course was there and I was like, oh, I really wanted to do your course last year, but it just didn’t fit in with my plans. Are you running Cardiff again? He was like, oh, no, we’re not running Cardiff anymore. And actually this might be the last one we run for a while, this London course next year. I was like, right. I really wanted to do it. It’s Keftactics, okay? That’s what it’s called, the course. And I was like, right. just bite the bullet, just do it. So I’ve been away in London quite a lot last year doing my PG cert in auto, but the guys running that course, Raj, he’s absolutely amazing. If anyone’s looking for an orthodontic course, it has been fantastic. And like the after course help, just like one-on-one
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
chats like this online, he’ll look through cases with you, second to none, honestly, it’s been amazing.
Andy & Chris:
Brilliant. That’s good to hear. That’s really nice. And I think that after support is quite important, isn’t it? Because I think lots of things that you learn in the moment until you start applying it, it never really becomes a learned experience. I’ve been talking about people when, you know, when you have driving lessons, you know, in the morning you’re not qualified. You have your test. And the examiner says, now you are. And by the afternoon, you’re in a car on your own. Nothing changing those few hours. You don’t have any experience. And I think there’s lots of things in life until you’ve built up a body of experience, you’re not truly competent. So it’s nice to hear that
Nathan Welch:
Mm.
Andy & Chris:
there’s that kind of follow on support. What does success look like for you? Hard question I know.
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, success for me would be being able to probably work for four days a week and having a day off where I didn’t actually do any dentistry
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
including admin and
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
Nathan Welch:
looking
Andy & Chris:
so
Nathan Welch:
at
Andy & Chris:
like
Nathan Welch:
cases.
Andy & Chris:
totally
Nathan Welch:
Yeah, totally
Andy & Chris:
business
Nathan Welch:
dental.
Andy & Chris:
free
Nathan Welch:
Even half a day doing that would be nice a week.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
Nathan Welch:
And
Andy & Chris:
how
Nathan Welch:
I do
Andy & Chris:
old
Nathan Welch:
hope
Andy & Chris:
how old
Nathan Welch:
to
Andy & Chris:
are
Nathan Welch:
get
Andy & Chris:
your
Nathan Welch:
there.
Andy & Chris:
children nathan?
Nathan Welch:
I’ve got… Well, they’re just about to turn four and two, six
Andy & Chris:
Ah,
Nathan Welch:
and two next week.
Andy & Chris:
right, okay. Yeah, spend more time with him.
Nathan Welch:
He’s actually, just before I came onto you, it was his first day in year one today.
Andy & Chris:
Oh wow
Nathan Welch:
So,
Andy & Chris:
exciting.
Nathan Welch:
just
Andy & Chris:
Wow.
Nathan Welch:
dropped him up to the bus, yeah. But
Andy & Chris:
That’s it.
Nathan Welch:
yeah, it is hard balancing two young kids and two businesses. I wouldn’t recommend doing them all at once, but we did and it can be done, but it’s hard.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
The best and worst thing was when we took over the first practice, Lara was actually on maternity leave. um for some of it and all right it was a you know she wasn’t on maternity leave she was officially on maternity leave from clinical dentistry
Andy & Chris:
Mmm.
Nathan Welch:
but she
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
was not on admin leave from practice ownership that’s for sure
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
um and it did so did that ruin her maternity leave possibly a little bit um and she would probably openly say that but definitely having that time to do admin
Andy & Chris:
helped.
Nathan Welch:
I could
Andy & Chris:
Mmm.
Nathan Welch:
be at work full time and she could do the sort of back end.
Andy & Chris:
I think there’s a there’s a kind of a fundamental flooring in dentists own practices when they talk about work And you nearly said it and you then adjusted it at the end when you said about not working and you meant and you then Said not just clinical but also admin and I think dentists very often when they talk about work That’s holding a handpiece if they’re not holding a handpiece. That’s not work So they almost don’t begrudge the Thursday night admin or the Sunday morning treatment planning
Nathan Welch:
Thank you.
Andy & Chris:
part of the job, the jobs when you’re in the surgery, and I think being able to accept it in totality and giving yourself truly time off so you do have evenings to yourself and you know not slipping into doing admin isn’t an easy thing to do but it can be done but I think it needs to be worked on over a period of time.
Nathan Welch:
I totally agree. And the work hours just creep up and up and up when you’ve got practice internship. Like I say, I used to walk out of work and I’d not even think about it again. I’d managed to get everything done in my working day when I was an associate, because
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
if a patient didn’t turn up, that was enough time to do my work admin.
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
That just doesn’t exist anymore.
Andy & Chris:
Right, yeah. There’s always something. So I guess your skateboarding career has taken a back seat then. Ha ha
Nathan Welch:
Terrible. Yeah, no, it’s been worth it. And, you know, my dad is one for an easy life. You know, he’s like, why do you keep getting so stressed and drop some commitments? And I’m like, I know, dad, but, you know, we’re working towards something that hopefully by the time I retire will mean that I can maybe retire a little bit early, enjoy the kids when they’re sort teenager, I don’t
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
Nathan Welch:
know.
Andy & Chris:
and you have
Nathan Welch:
It’s
Andy & Chris:
to try
Nathan Welch:
hard
Andy & Chris:
and get
Nathan Welch:
work
Andy & Chris:
that balance
Nathan Welch:
now for
Andy & Chris:
right.
Nathan Welch:
possibly
Andy & Chris:
You have
Nathan Welch:
rewards
Andy & Chris:
to get that
Nathan Welch:
later.
Andy & Chris:
balance right. That’s the most important thing. So is that you can actually spend time now working your. plan so that you do get your time off. Otherwise the danger is when you do get your time off, no one will actually want to see you. I must have, I’m pleased to hear that having another couple as business partners in Bridgend is going to certainly share that load as well. It won’t put quite such a responsibility on
Nathan Welch:
Good
Andy & Chris:
you
Nathan Welch:
night.
Andy & Chris:
and Lara to run that. And you’ve got experience that you can bring to the party that the couple you’re working with, is this their first time into practice
Nathan Welch:
It’s their
Andy & Chris:
ownership?
Nathan Welch:
first time here.
Andy & Chris:
Well, okay, so you can kind of mentor them through as well, which will be lovely. to find the roles, I think that would be my… Yes.
Nathan Welch:
Coral’s going to be there full time as well, so that’s really good. Like, even down in Cowbridge, me and Lara aren’t there full time at the moment. So it will be good to have one of the principals five days a week in Bridgend.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, I just think from a culture point of view and a leadership point of view, I think if you’re there all the time, it’s much easier to drive things forward if you’re not. People don’t kind of set out to work against you, but things just do slip a bit if you’re not present.
Nathan Welch:
We’re fairly slack at work, even when me and Lara are there in Calbridge, we let the girls get away with some stuff.
Andy & Chris:
I was going to say both of you strike me as fairly easy going, you know, affable people. So I don’t think
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
the whip gets cracked that often. I’d have thought. He’s a surfer, man. Yeah, exactly.
Nathan Welch:
It probably could do with being whipped slightly, but yeah, if the staff are happy,
Andy & Chris:
Let’s
Nathan Welch:
it’s
Andy & Chris:
just
Nathan Welch:
just,
Andy & Chris:
talk about
Nathan Welch:
it makes
Andy & Chris:
HR
Nathan Welch:
everything
Andy & Chris:
rules
Nathan Welch:
better.
Andy & Chris:
here.
Nathan Welch:
It just, the vibe in the practice is everything, right?
Andy & Chris:
No, exactly right. Exactly right. And I think it’s very easy to pick up on small things that really upset and hurt people and add no value. Yeah, and take you away from the biggest stuff that you’re trying to achieve. If people are happy, they’ll deliver great patient care and they’ll stay longer. If people aren’t happy, yeah, we talked about kind of, you know, one of the things we look at if we value practice is the retention of team. And when you see a schedule of people at work in a business and they’ve all been there three months, four months, nine months, you’re like there is something fundamentally long wrong with the leadership. When you see Peter had been there for five years, seven years, 11 years, there’s something good about why people want to stay. And I think if you can create an event where people want to stay, that’s great for business. That’s great for
Nathan Welch:
Yeah,
Andy & Chris:
the business.
Nathan Welch:
no, like since we’ve taken over, we’ve had a few staff leave, but not many really. It’s really, it’s a good stable team now. Mainly we’ve taken
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
new ones on just because of growth and
Andy & Chris:
Yep
Nathan Welch:
then someone’s been off on maternity leave. But yeah, a good team is everything.
Andy & Chris:
And team self-select, I think we’ve found over the years, that the environment you create and people will either select to stay or they will select to go if they don’t like the environment, you know. And not the fact that it’s a toxic environment, but sometimes people just don’t gel. And you end up down the line, you end up with a really good team.
Nathan Welch:
Mm.
Andy & Chris:
And then the hardest bit then is recruiting people to fit in with that team, isn’t it? That’s
Nathan Welch:
We’ve been
Andy & Chris:
what.
Nathan Welch:
really lucky. And we’ve taken on a lot of trainee nurses through the schemes. They’re staggered across the two years.
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
One of them actually finishes next month. But it’s been really good taking them on because the core staff we had were really good, the nursing staff. They’ve taught the trainees that way of doing it. So everyone works together. And I’m not saying that taking on a trained nurse wouldn’t be great because they come in ready to… do everything, there’s no
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
Nathan Welch:
learning curve, but they do it their way, which might not be the practice way, and I think they can ruffle
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
a few feathers sometimes when you… Some nurses can be quite stubborn, shall we say.
Andy & Chris:
Nathan, we always finish up the same way. We’ve got a couple of questions that we’d like to ask you. The first one is if you could be a fly on a wall in a certain situation, when would that be and where would you be? Who’d be there?
Nathan Welch:
So I put quite a lot of thought into this question because I knew it was coming. And I touched on it earlier about how Wales and England were different now in their NHS contract delivery. And I would like to have been a fly on the wall in the meeting where contract variation was decided for Wales because it is utter rubbish. And I need to know what happened in that meeting. Just need to. Since that came out, I’ve done everything I can to sort of fight it. I’ve joined the local dental committee.
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
I sit on a government work stream and I go to local cluster meetings for doctors, dentists and all allied health professionals.
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
Nathan Welch:
And I still just, I just can’t see how it works. I don’t know.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, that’d be an interesting room to be in. Yeah, when you find out the answer, let us know.
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
And our follow-up question is if you could meet somebody, who would you like to sit down and have a glass of wine, cup of coffee, pint of beer with?
Nathan Welch:
So this is more of a fun one. I don’t know if you guys are big in the points game in sort of the credit card miles and hotel points game, but there’s a website called Head for Points. I don’t know if any of you follow it. It’s a blog site and I’ve been a follower for years and years and I’ve redeemed probably well over a million airline points at least, but there used to be a commenter. He doesn’t, he’s nothing not affiliated with the site at all, but with the handle Genghis. I think he’s had some kids and he doesn’t comment anymore but he knew every single point loophole you could possibly imagine and I just need to pick his brain.
Andy & Chris:
Wow, wow, wow. So we need to find Genghis, the point
Nathan Welch:
Yeah,
Andy & Chris:
loophole king.
Nathan Welch:
I guess that’s not his actual name, you
Andy & Chris:
No,
Nathan Welch:
know, it’s
Andy & Chris:
no, no.
Nathan Welch:
just his handle. But yeah,
Andy & Chris:
Not many people Genghis.
Nathan Welch:
I don’t know if any of you guys like Avios and airline
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
Nathan Welch:
points and things like
Andy & Chris:
I think
Nathan Welch:
that,
Andy & Chris:
I
Nathan Welch:
but
Andy & Chris:
might’ve signed
Nathan Welch:
it’s
Andy & Chris:
up
Nathan Welch:
a big
Andy & Chris:
for that.
Nathan Welch:
hobby for me.
Andy & Chris:
And they send you loads and loads of emails if that’s the one I think it is. And in the end, I unsubscribed because it
Nathan Welch:
Head
Andy & Chris:
was like,
Nathan Welch:
for points.
Andy & Chris:
oh man, yeah, I don’t know if
Nathan Welch:
Yeah,
Andy & Chris:
it’s the same thing.
Nathan Welch:
I’m not an email subscriber, I just log in each day, but they send
Andy & Chris:
Oh.
Nathan Welch:
you all the articles by email. That’s why you get
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
Nathan Welch:
so many.
Andy & Chris:
it was like, oh man, so in the end I just unsubscribed because I couldn’t read them all. I know that travel points are a massive thing in dentistry because obviously lots of dental practice are able to buy materials using corporate company cards and
Nathan Welch:
Mm-hmm.
Andy & Chris:
the points rack up at quite a level and I know
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
I’ve seen online there’s been different chatter of when you just hop from one Eric’s card to another
Nathan Welch:
Mm-hmm.
Andy & Chris:
to get your companion ticket
Nathan Welch:
Yeah. Yeah, that’s
Andy & Chris:
and
Nathan Welch:
right
Andy & Chris:
there’s lots of lucrative
Nathan Welch:
When I had
Andy & Chris:
but
Nathan Welch:
more
Andy & Chris:
yeah
Nathan Welch:
time,
Andy & Chris:
so we
Nathan Welch:
you
Andy & Chris:
need
Nathan Welch:
know,
Andy & Chris:
to check
Nathan Welch:
and the rules were more relaxed, I used to change credit cards almost every three months.
Andy & Chris:
Wow. Wow, just to get more points.
Nathan Welch:
just to hit bonuses. They’ve cracked down on all that since COVID, but yeah, they used to be loophole after loophole and you could just accrue bonuses.
Andy & Chris:
Wow, I mean, I’m familiar with kind of air miles and avios, but I’d never thought that there was this whole sub world
Nathan Welch:
Yeah,
Andy & Chris:
of
Nathan Welch:
yeah.
Andy & Chris:
people kind of sharing the loopholes to make
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
it even better. Wow. Well,
Nathan Welch:
It’s one of the
Andy & Chris:
Nathan,
Nathan Welch:
only,
Andy & Chris:
it…
Nathan Welch:
like in America, this ridiculous, the points game out there, you know, if you read some of the American blogs, you do think, oh, what am I even doing it for? It’s worthless in the UK, but yeah.
Andy & Chris:
Wow,
Nathan Welch:
Credit card,
Andy & Chris:
interesting.
Nathan Welch:
Myles-Oo, they’re a great hobby, you know, you’re spending money anyway. It always upsets me when I’ve got friends and we go out for dinner and they pay on their debit card. That’s like my pet
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
hate. I’m like, you’re paying for something on your debit card? I
Andy & Chris:
You’re
Nathan Welch:
can’t
Andy & Chris:
missing.
Nathan Welch:
believe it. You’re getting
Andy & Chris:
You’re missing
Nathan Welch:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
out. You should be getting something for it. Yeah.
Nathan Welch:
Eh.
Andy & Chris:
Well, what I love is, is I think we’re, I don’t know how many episodes we’ve done now, 120 episodes, something like that. We could do this for the next 20 years. We are never ever going to get somebody saying, I want to Genghis from Head for Points
Nathan Welch:
HEEH!
Andy & Chris:
to be the person that I get to be. It’s a one-off, I reckon. It is a uniqueness. I love that,
Nathan Welch:
Uh,
Andy & Chris:
Nathan, absolutely brilliant.
Nathan Welch:
yeah.
Andy & Chris:
Go on, we’ll let you go. Thank you very much indeed for your time. Yeah, thank you for your time, brilliant. Like
Nathan Welch:
Alright,
Andy & Chris:
I say, I think
Nathan Welch:
nice
Andy & Chris:
it’s
Nathan Welch:
to speak to you
Andy & Chris:
brilliant.
Nathan Welch:
guys.
Andy & Chris:
And I’d love to hear more once it’s all set up and up and running. We’ll have to chat again and find
Nathan Welch:
Well, if
Andy & Chris:
out
Nathan Welch:
you come down
Andy & Chris:
what it looks
Nathan Welch:
Andy
Andy & Chris:
like.
Nathan Welch:
to visit your family in Carbridge pop in the TS.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, I will do, I’ll do, I’ll do, I’d love to. Appreciate your time, Nathan. Send send regards to Lara as well, keep well. Thanks
Nathan Welch:
Our
Andy & Chris:
very
Nathan Welch:
thanks.
Andy & Chris:
much, brilliant.
Nathan Welch:
Bye.
Andy & Chris:
Cheers, dad up.
